From my blog over the past few days:
February 13th, 2014, 10:08 pm
The starter clutch continued to deteriorate. Eccles stayed at the plant overnight twice, once when the ground fault plug tripped and I didn't notice and the second time yesterday when the old heater I was slipping under the engine finally died. Today Eccles sat inside the plant all day where it was nice & warm and it still took about 15 minutes of trying to get the SC to grab enough to turn the engine over fast enough to start. The drive home was the last trip for that engine. A co-worker will pick me up & drop me off tomorrow and by Monday I should have a reliable vehicle again.
Over the last couple of weeks I ordered the parts to rebuild the starter clutch (I know - the new engine's SC is probably good for a few years but after this winter I am not taking any chances), organized Kay picking up what I need, cut a few gaskets, moved stuff around in the bike parking space and the shop so we have room to work (I'd love to take over Kay's parking space where there is more room but it would take too many Kw to heat) and put everything and generally got ready.
Tonight I removed the seat, tank, covers, fairing &c and drained the oil & coolant. Tomorrow night the serious fun begins
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February 15th, 2014, 9:56 am
In from the shop at 1 AM. Engine is out, cleaned off pretty well and on the bench. I wish I could have washed it with the hose but instead we chipped a lot of the dirt off with tools and then washed it with a wet towel. Before wetting it seemed as hard as concrete.
Having breakfast now while waiting for the shop to warm up.
February 16th, 2014, 12:10 pm
In from the shop at 2 AM. New engine with old rear cover is sitting on the dolly ready to install.
When I removed the old engine's flywheel to examine the camchain, guide & tensioner and decide which ones to use the starter clutch parts fell out.
In case you aren't familiar with Honda starter clutches, here are links to the manual pages
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B6EDVo7 ... =6&w&pli=1
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B6EDVo7 ... =7&w&pli=1
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B6EDVo7 ... =8&w&pli=1
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B6EDVo7 ... er=7&w=822
(BTW: Current wisdom is not to disturb the torx screws unless they have come loose. If they have come loose the whole assembly probably needs to be replaced.)
Basically, the springs & caps push the rollers against the boss on the starter driven gear at an angle so that when the starter driven gear is turning faster than the engine the rollers grab the boss and the flywheel turns with the starter driven gear but when the engine starts and turns faster than the starter driven gear the rollers don't grab the boss.
There were wear marks on the rollers, the springs were very compressed (very few coils sticking out of the caps) and several coils short, the ends of the caps are actually dished where they contact the rollers and the boss on the starter driven gear that the rollers engage with has a lot of damage from the rollers hammering against it. The caged roller bearing that the starter driven gear runs on was very loose with wear marks on the rollers. 2 of the 3 torx screws were loose. The surfaces in the starter clutch outer and the flywheel where the ends of the rollers rub on them had very deep wear marks with burrs. It is a wonder that it was able to engage at all.
The new engine's starter driven gear boss is in very good condition, there is no wear from the ends of the rollers, the caged roller bearing is like new and I have installed new springs, caps & rollers. It should be a long time before this starter clutch gives me any trouble
![Image]()
When I drained the old engine's fluids the oil looked OK but the coolant had a layer of oil floating on top. When we it apart there was mayonnaise in the ignition cover and inside the rear cover and oil in the water pump. It looks like a head gasket has failed, but it was running pretty normally once it got started. It is starting to look like replacing the whole engine was a good idea.
From measuring the length of half a dozen links under tension, the new engine's camchain is in better shape than the one I put into the old engine 5 years ago. The rubber parts of the old engine's original tensioner & guide were hard when I replaced the camchain so I replaced them at that time too. The new engine's ones are still almost as soft as the 5 year old ones so I left them in too (I will save the 5 year old ones for when I replace the camchain in a year or 2).
The shop should be nice & warm now so its time we got to work.
February 17th, 2014, 8:19 am
Engine in & connected up to everything. Filled the oil & coolant in time to come in for dinner at around 8. Back to shop, hooked up gas tank and fired it up just before 10. It took a lot of cranking and when it started it smoked a lot (the guy I got it from had oiled the cylinders for storage) but it runs. I won't be able to say for sure until I run it under load but it sounds pretty nice so far.
Back to shop this morning, opened the door and fired it up again (just to make sure it would start when cold), then shut it off, closed the door and put the heat on. Kay says if Matt wants to go home today she will stop back here between patient calls and pick him up just after noon. All that is left to do that I need help with is putting the fairing back on (1 person to hold it in place, other person to start the first nut) so I should have no problem getting everything done in time to drive to work tomorrow.
February 17th, 2014, 7:45 pm
Fairing, seat, tank &c on & everything hooked up and working so I went for a short test drive. It felt right, sounded right and, as far as I could tell it worked right. I even had the clutch cable adjusted close enough.
You know, I had almost forgotten what its like to shift up from 4th and actually have it go into gear
![Image]()
This engine will require a bit of TLC before I am really happy with it and it will need a camchain next year but for now
Eccles Lives!!!!!!!!!!!
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February 13th, 2014, 10:08 pm
The starter clutch continued to deteriorate. Eccles stayed at the plant overnight twice, once when the ground fault plug tripped and I didn't notice and the second time yesterday when the old heater I was slipping under the engine finally died. Today Eccles sat inside the plant all day where it was nice & warm and it still took about 15 minutes of trying to get the SC to grab enough to turn the engine over fast enough to start. The drive home was the last trip for that engine. A co-worker will pick me up & drop me off tomorrow and by Monday I should have a reliable vehicle again.
Over the last couple of weeks I ordered the parts to rebuild the starter clutch (I know - the new engine's SC is probably good for a few years but after this winter I am not taking any chances), organized Kay picking up what I need, cut a few gaskets, moved stuff around in the bike parking space and the shop so we have room to work (I'd love to take over Kay's parking space where there is more room but it would take too many Kw to heat) and put everything and generally got ready.
Tonight I removed the seat, tank, covers, fairing &c and drained the oil & coolant. Tomorrow night the serious fun begins
February 15th, 2014, 9:56 am
In from the shop at 1 AM. Engine is out, cleaned off pretty well and on the bench. I wish I could have washed it with the hose but instead we chipped a lot of the dirt off with tools and then washed it with a wet towel. Before wetting it seemed as hard as concrete.
Having breakfast now while waiting for the shop to warm up.
February 16th, 2014, 12:10 pm
In from the shop at 2 AM. New engine with old rear cover is sitting on the dolly ready to install.
When I removed the old engine's flywheel to examine the camchain, guide & tensioner and decide which ones to use the starter clutch parts fell out.
In case you aren't familiar with Honda starter clutches, here are links to the manual pages
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B6EDVo7 ... =6&w&pli=1
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B6EDVo7 ... =7&w&pli=1
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B6EDVo7 ... =8&w&pli=1
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B6EDVo7 ... er=7&w=822
(BTW: Current wisdom is not to disturb the torx screws unless they have come loose. If they have come loose the whole assembly probably needs to be replaced.)
Basically, the springs & caps push the rollers against the boss on the starter driven gear at an angle so that when the starter driven gear is turning faster than the engine the rollers grab the boss and the flywheel turns with the starter driven gear but when the engine starts and turns faster than the starter driven gear the rollers don't grab the boss.
There were wear marks on the rollers, the springs were very compressed (very few coils sticking out of the caps) and several coils short, the ends of the caps are actually dished where they contact the rollers and the boss on the starter driven gear that the rollers engage with has a lot of damage from the rollers hammering against it. The caged roller bearing that the starter driven gear runs on was very loose with wear marks on the rollers. 2 of the 3 torx screws were loose. The surfaces in the starter clutch outer and the flywheel where the ends of the rollers rub on them had very deep wear marks with burrs. It is a wonder that it was able to engage at all.
The new engine's starter driven gear boss is in very good condition, there is no wear from the ends of the rollers, the caged roller bearing is like new and I have installed new springs, caps & rollers. It should be a long time before this starter clutch gives me any trouble
When I drained the old engine's fluids the oil looked OK but the coolant had a layer of oil floating on top. When we it apart there was mayonnaise in the ignition cover and inside the rear cover and oil in the water pump. It looks like a head gasket has failed, but it was running pretty normally once it got started. It is starting to look like replacing the whole engine was a good idea.
From measuring the length of half a dozen links under tension, the new engine's camchain is in better shape than the one I put into the old engine 5 years ago. The rubber parts of the old engine's original tensioner & guide were hard when I replaced the camchain so I replaced them at that time too. The new engine's ones are still almost as soft as the 5 year old ones so I left them in too (I will save the 5 year old ones for when I replace the camchain in a year or 2).
The shop should be nice & warm now so its time we got to work.
February 17th, 2014, 8:19 am
Engine in & connected up to everything. Filled the oil & coolant in time to come in for dinner at around 8. Back to shop, hooked up gas tank and fired it up just before 10. It took a lot of cranking and when it started it smoked a lot (the guy I got it from had oiled the cylinders for storage) but it runs. I won't be able to say for sure until I run it under load but it sounds pretty nice so far.
Back to shop this morning, opened the door and fired it up again (just to make sure it would start when cold), then shut it off, closed the door and put the heat on. Kay says if Matt wants to go home today she will stop back here between patient calls and pick him up just after noon. All that is left to do that I need help with is putting the fairing back on (1 person to hold it in place, other person to start the first nut) so I should have no problem getting everything done in time to drive to work tomorrow.
February 17th, 2014, 7:45 pm
Fairing, seat, tank &c on & everything hooked up and working so I went for a short test drive. It felt right, sounded right and, as far as I could tell it worked right. I even had the clutch cable adjusted close enough.
You know, I had almost forgotten what its like to shift up from 4th and actually have it go into gear
This engine will require a bit of TLC before I am really happy with it and it will need a camchain next year but for now
Eccles Lives!!!!!!!!!!!
....
